Skill: Tweaks for Tattoo of Balance

Suggestions for game development and improvements. One suggestion to a thread, please.
Post Reply
User avatar
Freech
Posts: 17
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2023 9:03 pm

Skill: Tweaks for Tattoo of Balance

Post by Freech »

While the class isn't in a terrible place, Nexus Champions that go for Balance have a lot of downtime.

Your options to maintain zero are:
- being selective with your targets proactively
- taking what you can get first and shifting back later

Both of these are AP expensive, but that isn't necessarily a bad thing. Petmasters usually have downtime, too, after all. The sticking point is what the player gets in exchange for that downtime.

Assuming both the tattoo of Equilibrium and Nexal Spark (120 character points), an NC at 0 gets:
- +4 damage
- 10% defense
- 12 retaliation damage
- Arcane damage Nexal Spark attack

It's pretty nice on paper, but it goes away pretty quickly even with the adjustments to MO from Tattoo of Balance--especially if you're raiding.

In practice, this means after your blaze of glory, at best every other AP cycle is spent getting back to 0.

I'm not averse to the idea of upkeep for benefits, but I think the ratio could stand to be less severe.

Some ideas:

- Tattoo of Balance accelerates any shift towards zero and slows down any shift away from it. (Presently it gets you out of the Evil trap but technically keeps you Good for longer.)
- A 30 point child skill that essentially gives the effects of (and stacks with?) Incense of Centering.


I'm not overly attached to either solution, but I do think the current state of things is not ideal. *Some* sort of change would be warranted, considering you're effectively spending 4 levels of tier 3 XP to be "pretty good" every other day at best.
User avatar
Riss
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2021 6:58 am

Re: Skill: Tweaks for Tattoo of Balance

Post by Riss »

I don't dislike Tattoo of Balance. It's strong. It's thematic. As a maxxed NC in an evil faction, I find it manageable to maintain. But as a numbers junkie, I constantly try to stay at 0 MO. It's annoying, but that's my flaw, YMMV.
In my opinion, however, it is not comparable to other free skills. Probably if it cost CP I wouldn't have taken it.

Tattoo of Equilibrium is simply not worth it. Against a petshield it is consumed immediately (damaging pets with an aura affects your MO), so it's only useful against other players. But with the NPC revolution I find that I get hunted much less.
Jayne Cobb | your doppelgänger | Rhialto the Marvellous | an eerie melody | the man who sold the world | Duncan Idaho

Sorry for any mistakes. English is not my native language.
User avatar
Freech
Posts: 17
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2023 9:03 pm

Re: Skill: Tweaks for Tattoo of Balance

Post by Freech »

It's thematic, and I'd be lying if I said it wasn't fun to maintain, but I'd have to disagree that it's strong, personally.

One raid on any decently sized faction tends to wipe most of it away unless I bring an Incense of Centering.

That is a lot of work and preparation for something that other classes can just buy a skill and Get.

I'm happy with maintaining it, really, and I think that's flavorful and fun, but I'd like it if the reward either lasted longer, took less to maintain, or was more substantial. It doesn't have to be ridiculously long, but I think the thresholds as they are need a little more lenience. The flavor is dope, but the reward is mostly cope.

EDIT: To provide a little more about my experiences playing the class:

My NC raided Pirates of R'lyeh maybe a week or two ago, and because I forgot to bring a funny incense, I left that raid with 30 MO. Subsequent bad luck in getting MO shifts with Arcane books meant that I essentially spent 3 cycles getting back to zero. I eventually just said 'to hell with it' and ended up disabling power the rest of the way down. Benefits that last 'one engagement' should not come with the gamble that you might be spending days getting them back.

To provide actual suggestions instead of just 'what's wrong:'
A child skill that temporarily halts MO shifts and applies them all at once would retain the bursty flavor of the base tattoo while resolving the issue of "four swings kills my benefits."

Alternatively, a child skill that costs MP to move all MO shifts towards 0 for a time would make the maintenance a lot easier and more in line with the scope of the benefits.
Masumi
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2022 11:51 pm
Location: London

Re: Skill: Tweaks for Tattoo of Balance

Post by Masumi »

On a large scale, lowering MO is rarely a problem, I find, between murdering passing mortals and writing in their blood. But once you're below -20 that climb back can be a very steep one.

But yes, only getting a serious bonus for half a dozen hits is not great. It doesn't help that Incense of Centering is produced at 1/6 of the rate of other potions, which makes it a big investment for an alchemist as well. And you never have a match when you need one...
Last edited by Masumi on Wed Feb 21, 2024 2:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Yeah.
lunalu
Posts: 64
Joined: Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:27 am

Re: Skill: Tweaks for Tattoo of Balance

Post by lunalu »

I agree with all the above. I shelved my NC because it felt so bad to use. I'm pretty sure a lot of suggestions were placed in ncg months ago, including tools that snapshot your current mo for an considerable cost (or less cost but then applied the mo differences after X time) and tools to help move mo back to centre more easily. I also think some of the older players mentioned a skill that used to allow you to have bonuses closer to +40/-40 which might be nicer for NCS in non neutral factions.

As it is, NC is a chore to play. I get it doesn't have a lot of attention, not being a dev favourite and not one of the more popular classes but a bit of rework would go a long way making this class fun to play
User avatar
Riss
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2021 6:58 am

Re: Skill: Tweaks for Tattoo of Balance

Post by Riss »

I raise my MO by killing imps. It's easy because I respawn in Stygia, thanks to my awesome DO. I also prevent my MO from rising too much by using Boons of Abiding Wickedness, again thanks to the desecrations to my awesome DO. Become a vassal of a shy miko too, for me 5/5 flaming skulls! ;)

As for a concrete suggestion: how about relating the damage of Tattoo of Balance to the ratio between angels and demons? If demons > angels the NC gain +3 dam vs demons and -2 vs angels (to preserve equilibrium) and viceversa?
Jayne Cobb | your doppelgänger | Rhialto the Marvellous | an eerie melody | the man who sold the world | Duncan Idaho

Sorry for any mistakes. English is not my native language.
lunalu
Posts: 64
Joined: Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:27 am

Re: Skill: Tweaks for Tattoo of Balance

Post by lunalu »

Oh my. You're making Miko blush!
User avatar
Goliath
Posts: 698
Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2021 10:01 am

Re: Skill: Tweaks for Tattoo of Balance

Post by Goliath »

Honestly, I think NCs are a very neat class overall, but suffer from a bunch of small issues.
- Their free skill is awkward (though the "you're always considered neutral for MO gain" bit is real cool). Equilibrium is extra awkward (and a bit too strong defensively when you can stay centered).
- Adaptation is absurdly broken on the right situations, including live combat.
- Their travel skill is awesome, but extremely clunky.
- Their build relies on skills building upon one another, which makes their early levels somewhat weak.
- All of their skills (except bow innate) are useful on any of their builds, which lets them get stronger with each bit of CP they get, which is a bit of a problem.
- Dragons Rage makes them too good at bashing compared to other Myrmidons, which isn't a problem of itself, but makes balancing Myrmidon bashing harder.
A Parrot with a Blade - Melee/Touchcaster Holy Champion || GrayScimitar - Heavy Sword Tlac IB || RustyWire - Gunwiz
Post Reply